The *OFFICIAL* Russia Is About To Invade Ukraine Thread

[SteakNEggs]

Why is every unhinged conservative in here up our *** about Biden. Nobody here likes him, really. Sorry he dumped your boy Trump, but It's not like he's very removed from any of your ****** values. This country is so weird.

I made this:

View attachment 13934

What does this have to do with a war? It's funny hearing capitalist cry about capitalism. It's like Bernie having 3 homes charging $95 for even tickets. You all cry yet love capitalism.

You all don't like Biden? Then where are you in the Biden thread,? Oh that's right obsessing about a guy that has no impact on anything. And you guys have the audacity to point at me? Trump is all you talk about.

The counter is in the *****et right now and you guys do nothing but obsess about Trump. Were up in your **** because you put us in this war. You put us in record inflation. You put us a recession. You put us in record crime waves. You put us into a failing housing market. You literally surrendered Afghanistan and bombed families. You voted for this. This is your fault . I mean duh...

 

[sirkickyass]

Ok break it down then. Let's see it. 75 billion dollars... This post is extremely vague and does no such thing.

There's a reason I asked if you had a specific disbursement you were curious about. There is no one $75 billion transaction. There's a series of smaller transactions, each of which can be pretty cleanly broken down into types of purchases and transfers.

That's why I don't think you actually know what you are asking for. I think you're saying you want every penny for every disbursement regardless of category of aid. That request is objectively unreasonable and, to quote the great Ralph Wiggum, unpossible. It's an aggregated value that involves a lot of different kinds of transactions that are not of a similar nature. You're asking for an extremely complex accounting that most people would never be able to understand without the help of a professional. It's sort of like asking to inspect the engineering schematics of a nuclear submarine. Even if you saw it, the information wouldn't be helpful.


There will not ever be any one document that does what you're asking for, and there has never been a similar document for any other federal program of similar size and scope. The smaller allocations are disbursed individually through different federal departments and different programs. Some of those amounts will have an accounting figure because they relate to the value of an existing stock that transfers ownership, rather than an actual purchase that is made. So, for example, artillery ammunition that is transferred from stores on the Korean peninsula have a "value," and would be included in an "aid figure" headline that will be collectively added into the $75 billion. But there will never be a "purchase" after the announcement is made that ties a specific procurement order to those artillery shells. From the perspective of your request, it would seem like they appeared out of nowhere.

In sum, life is more complicated than slogans. If you're actually interested in having a discussion about "where does this money go" I have some real answers for you.* If you're just trying to repeat things you've heard on tv/radio/random blog, it's not worth my time.


*The answer is usually Alabama for what it's worth.

 

[SteakNEggs]

There's a reason I asked if you had a specific disbursement you were curious about. There is no one $75 billion transaction. There's a series of smaller transactions, each of which can be pretty cleanly broken down into types of purchases and transfers.

That's why I don't think you actually know what you are asking for. I think you're saying you want every penny for every disbursement regardless of category of aid. That request is objectively unreasonable and, to quote the great Ralph Wiggum, unpossible. It's an aggregated value that involves a lot of different kinds of transactions that are not of a similar nature. You're asking for an extremely complex accounting that most people would never be able to understand without the help of a professional. It's sort of like asking to inspect the engineering schematics of a nuclear submarine. Even if you saw it, the information wouldn't be helpful.


There will not ever be any one document that does what you're asking for, and there has never been a similar document for any other federal program of similar size and scope. The smaller allocations are disbursed individually through different federal departments and different programs. Some of those amounts will have an accounting figure because they relate to the value of an existing stock that transfers ownership, rather than an actual purchase that is made. So, for example, artillery ammunition that is transferred from stores on the Korean peninsula have a "value," and would be included in an "aid figure" headline that will be collectively added into the $75 billion. But there will never be a "purchase" after the announcement is made that ties a specific procurement order to those artillery shells. From the perspective of your request, it would seem like they appeared out of nowhere.

In sum, life is more complicated than slogans. If you're actually interested in having a discussion about "where does this money go" I have some real answers for you.* If you're just trying to repeat things you've heard on tv/radio/random blog, it's not worth my time.


*The answer is usually Alabama for what it's worth.

You're right as this is common sense but to sit and say we don't need to know where soon to be 100 billion dollars is going is just fiscally stupid. I mean obviously we aren't counting every penny but Ukraine is historically known for corruption and you get bent out of shape for someone even wondering where 75 BILLION dollars is going. How is that a bad thing? Especially when problems back home are needed attention to.

You guys act like Ukraine is some saint country when in reality it is amongst the most corrupt countries in the world and historically has been. Im tired of us fighting every war and funding every war. Especially for two countries who don't give a **** about us. You all can hate Trump but it's an undeniable fact that he was one of the most peaceful presidents in modern US history as far as keeping us and getting us out if conflict.

Now the entire globe is unstable. All because the most prominent country is lead by a guy who has the brain capacity of a houseplant and thinks there's 54 states. So no I'm not saying let's count every penny, I'm saying how much of this money is going to the wrong hands? To deny Ukraine isn't historically corrupt is a lie. To be clear I do think there is a looooot of being made by both Republicans and Democrats over a needless war.


Here is a very recent time article:

What to Know About the Corruption Scandals Sweeping Ukraine's Government

Amajor effort to root out corruption is sweeping Ukraine. In recent weeks, leaders have announced the results of several major investigations, as well as firings and resignations across its government.

What to Know About Ukraine's Corruption Scandals

The Ukrainian government unveiled a shake-up of government leadership in recent weeks.

time.com

 

[One Brow]

Ok break it down then. Let's see it. 75 billion dollars... This post is extremely vague and does no such thing.

"75 billion dollars" is a vague claim. Show us where in the budget we'll see an increase of 75 billion dollars.

 

[sirkickyass]

You're right as this is common sense but to sit and say we don't need to know where soon to be 100 billion dollars is going is just fiscally stupid. I mean obviously we aren't counting every penny but Ukraine is historically known for corruption and you get bent out of shape for someone even wondering where 75 BILLION dollars is going. How is that a bad thing? Especially when problems back home are needed attention to.

You guys act like Ukraine is some saint country when in reality it is amongst the most corrupt countries in the world and historically has been. Im tired of us fighting every war and funding every war. Especially for two countries who don't give a **** about us. You all can hate Trump but it's an undeniable fact that he was one of the most peaceful presidents in modern US history as far as keeping us and getting us out if conflict.

Now the entire globe is unstable. All because the most prominent country is lead by a guy who has the brain capacity of a houseplant and thinks there's 54 states. So no I'm not saying let's count every penny, I'm saying how much of this money is going to the wrong hands? To deny Ukraine isn't historically corrupt is a lie. To be clear I do think there is a looooot of being made by both Republicans and Democrats over a needless war.


Here is a very recent time article:

What to Know About the Corruption Scandals Sweeping Ukraine's Government

Amajor effort to root out corruption is sweeping Ukraine. In recent weeks, leaders have announced the results of several major investigations, as well as firings and resignations across its government.

What to Know About Ukraine's Corruption Scandals

The Ukrainian government unveiled a shake-up of government leadership in recent weeks.

time.com

Ukraine's corruption problem is a carry-over from the Soviet Union and what your article says is that Ukraine has gotten serious about anti-corruption efforts, including snaring Ihor Kolomoisky - an oligarch that Zelensky arguably had a personal interest in (Kolomoisky owned the television station that ran Zelenksy's show Sluga Naroda) and who has been historically the most bulletproof of all oligarchs.

The depths of Ukraine's corruption were in the 1990s, when the Odessa ports were the most porous in the world paired with efficient loading technology. Smuggling paradise.

The roots of Ukraine's revolutionary history over the last 20 years have really been about seriously tackling corruption, and the primary differences between Russian and Ukrainian governing philosophy come down to those efforts.

Does Ukraine have corruption issues? Yes. Of course.

Are the Ukrainians taking it seriously and has the issue been steadily improving for the last ten years. Also obviously yes (with some regional variation - Odessa itself has the most entrenched issues)

That Ukraine's soviet past has made it harder to establish a free and just society is not a compelling reason to abandon 40 million people to an empire set on genociding them and destroying the very idea of Ukraine. That's blaming the victim.

 

[SteakNEggs]

Ukraine's corruption problem is a carry-over from the Soviet Union and what your article says is that Ukraine has gotten serious about anti-corruption efforts, including snaring Ihor Kolomoisky - an oligarch that Zelensky arguably had a personal interest in (Kolomoisky owned the television station that ran Zelenksy's show Sluga Naroda) and who has been historically the most bulletproof of all oligarchs.

The depths of Ukraine's corruption were in the 1990s, when the Odessa ports were the most porous in the world paired with efficient loading technology. Smuggling paradise.

The roots of Ukraine's revolutionary history over the last 20 years have really been about seriously tackling corruption, and the primary differences between Russian and Ukrainian governing philosophy come down to those efforts.

Does Ukraine have corruption issues? Yes. Of c ofourse.

Are the Ukrainians taking it seriously and has the issue been steadily improving for the last ten years. Also obviously yes (with some regional variation - Odessa itself has the most entrenched issues)

That Ukraine's soviet past has made it harder to establish a free and just society is not a compelling reason to abandon 40 million people to an empire set on genociding them and destroying the very idea of Ukraine. That's blaming the victim.

I appreciate the post and sorry to be so short but what's the endgame here? We just surrendered a 20 year war in the ME and now we're supposed to carry Ukraine? For how long? How long until this escalates even further. The world is destabilizing more and more each day and this war is a main culprit. Even if it stays in Ukraine we're talking hundreds of billions of dollars in not trillions in money and equipment.

 

[SteakNEggs]

Actually we have already signed up for over 120 billion and now Milley is saying that they will need more in June or that Ukraine could suffer greatly. Meanwhile NATO has contributed a small fraction of that.

 

[mongoose01]

Are you Putin puppets insinuating a resolution of peace!!! That’s crazy talk…

 

[Gameface]

Are you Putin puppets insinuating a resolution of peace!!! That’s crazy talk…

The resolution of peace will happen when all Russian forces have removed themselves from Ukraine, including Crimea. Russia can make peace happen latter today if they want peace.

 

[fishonjazz]

Yep peace is easily attainable. Russia doesnt want peace though

 

[LogGrad98]

There's a reason I asked if you had a specific disbursement you were curious about. There is no one $75 billion transaction. There's a series of smaller transactions, each of which can be pretty cleanly broken down into types of purchases and transfers.

That's why I don't think you actually know what you are asking for. I think you're saying you want every penny for every disbursement regardless of category of aid. That request is objectively unreasonable and, to quote the great Ralph Wiggum, unpossible. It's an aggregated value that involves a lot of different kinds of transactions that are not of a similar nature. You're asking for an extremely complex accounting that most people would never be able to understand without the help of a professional. It's sort of like asking to inspect the engineering schematics of a nuclear submarine. Even if you saw it, the information wouldn't be helpful.


There will not ever be any one document that does what you're asking for, and there has never been a similar document for any other federal program of similar size and scope. The smaller allocations are disbursed individually through different federal departments and different programs. Some of those amounts will have an accounting figure because they relate to the value of an existing stock that transfers ownership, rather than an actual purchase that is made. So, for example, artillery ammunition that is transferred from stores on the Korean peninsula have a "value," and would be included in an "aid figure" headline that will be collectively added into the $75 billion. But there will never be a "purchase" after the announcement is made that ties a specific procurement order to those artillery shells. From the perspective of your request, it would seem like they appeared out of nowhere.

In sum, life is more complicated than slogans. If you're actually interested in having a discussion about "where does this money go" I have some real answers for you.* If you're just trying to repeat things you've heard on tv/radio/random blog, it's not worth my time.


*The answer is usually Alabama for what it's worth.

Great answer.

He is a known troll, btw, albeit not a very successful one. So that might save you some time.

 

[SteakNEggs]

Great answer.

He is a known troll, btw, albeit not a very successful one. So that might save you some time.

I am no troll. Unlike log I can conversate and bring my pov as I did above. Trolling to me would be never adding anything of substance outside of being triggered by others like you constantly do. I can use my words and state my points you add nothing but trying to bully others. But just to prove it's him trolling and not me... What specifically did I troll about? What specific topic was I trolling? I guarantee you Log cant answer. 100% he wont. He makes claims but never actually follows through. He's just being melodramatic. Now I will admit I did call others names but that was me being childish myself and I apologized for that. It was getting frustrating having to conversate but have guys like Log adding nothing but name calling himself. I stooped to his low low low level and I apologized.

Just watch.